Hi folks, Just dropping in with a question for you all.

Discussion in 'General' started by Chris_UK, Aug 9, 2021.

  1. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    I am aware that my usage of ISPConfig is kind of irregular, however I have just managed to overcome an issue that I have had for some years now where I could not get LE certs for my secondary servers.

    My setup, ISPConfig primary server with 4 secondary servers.
    Home internet (Single IP, using port forwarding)

    With this setup I can offer one of each service, db, dns, web, mx on my local network. Basically I can serve one of any service that requires a standard port to operate normally and only one, eg, mx on port 25 because its standard changing it would break the internet or some such (I Jest).

    The reason I am here today:
    The issue: no web server available on any of the secondaries (other than the actual secondary web server) and dns acme is a non starter as it requires manual entry of the record at my dns host.

    The solution: Acme sharing, okay its not really acme sharing, what it is is a share from the web server that makes available to the secondary server a method of using the http 01 acme challenge so obtain a cert for itself.

    So, the reason for this post, my question to you is this. Are you, like me, using ispconfig in a home or small office network and handling things the way I described?

    If so would you use acme sharing if it was made available to you? I ask this because I am actually working on something for the installer right now and I want to know how deep to take this, Full integration or just a plugin that would only need 2 or three lines of code within the installer itself?

    A full version would mean a much deeper integration with ISPConfig because I would need to build in renewals and a few other things. Would you prefer to run something like this manually or prefer to keep fully automated? I a good with either approach to be honest with you and I really do not mind working on this.

    I hope you will respond/
  2. ahrasis

    ahrasis Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    Basically as I thought and shared before, you can simply use dns challenge for all servers, as I also used this method on mine.

    I was the one proposing the original code for automation of creation and renewal ISPConfig LE certs on its install and update, and it basically also have the standalone method, other than webroot method, but this also need access to port 80 directly as well.

    So your choice is kind of limited to nfs as you are doing right now, other than dns challenge method I suggested.

    Or if you want more, you can try proxy server as your main server, passing to all other servers whatever queries for whatever ports.
  3. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    I was running a proxy for a while, but dropped it, i forget why but I had a good enough reason.

    In any case, what i'm looking for here is to either prove or disprove that my usage of ispconfig is more than a select few that choose to be different. If it is then I am more than happy to dig in and push on with full integration, if not I would also be happy to create it as a stand-alone. I'm just looking for which direction to take it. I mean honestly if you and I are the only two people using ISPConfig in the way that we do then its probably not worth the time.
  4. ahrasis

    ahrasis Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    What are the reasons?

    To me the concept of running server(s) is still the same what ever software you choose to use but I don't think there are select few running server(s) at homes and offices as they are many of them except they normally are not running that server(s) for business like what you intended to do.

    That said, I think ISPConfig supposedly can do that as well with minimal help from some other software(s) and hardware(s).
  5. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    To be fair ISPConfig itself isn't particularly used for business, more as a tool to make it easier to manage the systems that I do use for business.

    Then again, at some point that could very well change, I have maintained my hosting domain registration for many years now for that very possibility. In that case I wouldn't be running things locally anyway. More servers, co-location etc is how I would make that work.

    This is all something of a hobby I suppose. Aside from running my business website and mail server of course. Everything else is either for developing, testing or learning purposes.
  6. ahrasis

    ahrasis Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    A good point I'd say and good luck in whatever you choose to do.

    By the way, ISPConfig is also meant for business and many have use it for that purpose. ;)
    Chris_UK likes this.
  7. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    I just took a very brief tour of the billing module demo, I wasn't sure what the client saw on their side.

    Its minimal, but it does fit into the ISPConfig design without standing out as something that's been dropped in, the pdf invoice is a nice thing to see.

    I did not though see how things get ordered by the client. How do they know what's on offer? okay we are off topic but I am interested in knowing.
  8. ahrasis

    ahrasis Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    That's why you'll need ISPConfig API to design things for your front page as per your requirement. Many would simply use WHCMS as their front page though it is not free but would be an ease of mind to maintain compared to own front page solution. On the other hand, advanced developers may find own front page solution is more preferable.
  9. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    Until I saw the state of things over at WHMCS of late I would have whole heartedly agreed with you. For me its not going to be an option, I bought a license through a reseller back in 2007 I think it was. I wanted to move my website and reissue the license to do it. I couldn't and was up-sold an upgrade to the full owned license. Fine I suppose. I bought the live chat module, iphone module, I also paid for upgrades this one being an annual fee.

    I folded the hosting some years later so let the upgrades lapse. No point paying a fee for what I am not using right?

    WHMCS current stance on owned licenses is they are grandfathered, you own it and are permitted to use it indefinitely but without support or upgrades. Great right?
    Not quite, as such you are limited to the available versions on the date your most recent upgrade license expired. For myself this is version 5.2. Assuming somebody bought their last upgrade in 2016 (I think this was the last time they were available) they would be limited to I think somewhere in the 8 major releases. Still, they will fall behind and eventually like my myself have a dinosaur of a system that is no longer fit for use in a modern configuration.

    In essence I own a license, its useless and on principle I refuse to pay them any more money, so much so that I just moved my domain registrar away from ENOM because they provided the reseller account.

    Honestly, this would not be half as bad if WHMCS said, look we will not offer you support or upgrades, but as you are essentially left in limbo, we will provide you with the source for your version. But they don't, its locked, you can't fix it, they wont fix it. Nice company.
  10. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    Sorry for the WHMCS rant, as you can imagine it hits a very raw nerve with me.
  11. nhybgtvfr

    nhybgtvfr Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    you could try hostbill instead..
    although their ispconfig plugin/connector appears to be written, as far as i can tell, for ispconfig2, it doesn't add domains to the domain list if client limit module is enabled, doesn't create email domains etc.
    it does sort of work, but definitely needs more done on it ( it'll create a client account, website / db etc, although it creates each website under a different ispconfig client, even if they're all the same hostbill client :mad:). they did do some work for me for free, so i can assign ispconfig additional client limit templates to product add-ons in hostbill.
    you can get the source code for the hostbill-ispconfig connector (although it costs a bit more to get that) so you can do that yourself, but if we can get as many people as possible asking them to update it properly for ispconfig 3.2, then maybe we can convince them it's worth devoting their own dev resources to getting the full ispconfig api functionality implemented through hostbill.
  12. Chris_UK

    Chris_UK Active Member HowtoForge Supporter

    No need for myself currently, ISPConfig does all i need and some more besides (for the time being). I have not decided as yet whether I will host again. I could but not as yet.

    To be absolutely clear about WHMCS, they have put a lot of work into their software and ) would recommend it to anybody who is setting out right now as a good option all be it one where you pay based on client number rather than buy the service outright.

    The reason I will not is purely on the principal, that they have all but abandoned customers that have been with them in some cases over a decade. I am aware this is largely to do with the sale of WHMCS and its just business. But just business has put their "legacy" in a bad position.

    Consider this. You purchase a house, you pay off the mortgage and you renovate said house.
    Some time later the bank comes to you, Hey, we know you own that house but you cannot renovate it any further so to maintain a high standard of living you will have to rent this house from us, and you will have to do so based on the number of people living in it.

    Would you stand for this or would you tell them to go away in short jerky movements?
  13. nhybgtvfr

    nhybgtvfr Well-Known Member HowtoForge Supporter

    i know exactly what you mean. we have a fully owned whmcs license. this recent change pisses me off, so we're looking for alternatives.

    the way whmcs is licensing itself now, 1 customer buying 1 domain name is an active client, so you could end up with 251 clients only buying a single domain name each and they'll want $30/month +vat. it's a joke.
    Chris_UK likes this.

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